Southside Times Editorial

The following is a recent editorial that appeared in the Southside Times newspaper. I believe this editorial exquisite illustrates the frustration, desire and expectations of those involved with Take Back Perry Schools.Â

Our View: Enough is enough

Perry Township schools belong to Perry Township residents.

The school board doesn’t own them. Board members merely are elected representatives of the people.

The board is accountable to the people. Its responsibilities include over-seeing the spending of revenues, the hiring of key personnel, contract obligations, and setting the policies and practices which direct day-to-day operations.

The danger is when board members try to become administrators and usurp some of the responsibilities of the superintendent. That’s what we see in the Perry Township school system. The board is in a defensive posture and doesn’t seem to understand the hostilities coming toward it.

This shouldn’t happen. The board needs to set the proper environment for the best possible student achievement. The administration must support what goes on between teacher and child in the classroom.

Perry Township school board members first must continually listen to public sentiment, whether it is at a board meeting or on a street corner. Such feedback is invaluable in setting goals and objectives that best meet the needs of children. Don’t turn a deaf ear when students, parents, faculty, staff and taxpayers want to comment. After all, they do own the schools.

The superintendent is the educational leader of the school system. He must gauge the values and opinions of the school district’s public to offer courses of action to the board.

Criticisms of the superintendent, Dr. H. Douglas Williams’ actions by opposing board members should have been handled in executive session and not at public board meetings. If a majority of the board believed Williams was not carrying out duties effectively, and he was given ample opportunities to get in line with the board’s expectations, then his removal would be much more defensible than the situation we have now.

Williams is a popular chief executive. He has strong support by the Perry Education Association and from a large group of parents and former school board members. He has been at the helm 14 years, which is a long tenure for a superintendent. He was named Superintendent of the Year in 2003, which should single him out as one of Indiana’s top administrators.

It is our belief that the Perry Board should stop playing administrator, and not get their egos and feelings so easily hurt. Board members must get behind a strong superintendent right away.

Delays, caused by the current tension and turmoil, are hurting educational programs - and, most of all, the students themselves. Morale among faculty and staff is declining. Its effects will take a terrible toll.

The Perry Township School Board should start listening and get the school system moving again.

53 Responses to “Southside Times Editorial”


  1. 1 Aware but... Feb 16th, 2007 at 10:40 pm

    To those PT residents who were awaiting facts:

    In the Southside Times and Indianapolis Star editorials, the editorial boards of each paper have researched this situation and published their findings. The boards are not board members nor are they members of TBPS. Their job is to research the facts and come up with a stand based on the facts they find. In the case of the termination of Dr. Williams, I might say the facts they didn’t find.

    At any rate, some of you have written that you were waiting to discover the facts and then make your decisions about this gang of 4 board. At last, you have some credible information to add to your analysis. Good luck to each of you. Perhaps now you better understand why so many of us fellow residents are so upset. The 4 need to go, and not just because of Dr. Williams!

  2. 2 Kelly M/S Feb 19th, 2007 at 2:22 pm

    Here is another piece of information regarding the Southside Times and the Indianapolis Star — both have connections to Lee Robbbins and Doug Williams! Both papers have family members of both men on staff who are editors and also writers. I suggest everyone do their own independent research. Here are a few links to help you on your search…

    http://www.in.gov

    http://www.in.gov/legislative/ic/code/

    http://www.in.gov/sboa/

    http://www.doe.state.in.us/reed/

    http://www.nsba.org/site/index.asp

    I found a LOT of useful information on these sites…and just on the IC website alone found numerous indiscretions of Dr. Williams and some members of his administration.

    Also, regarding the hiring of an “additional” attorney: He is not an “additional” attorney come to find out. John Bailey is being kept as the district’s attorney (the whole district of Perry Township-not JUST the Gang of Four) and in his own discovery of the current investigation wanted a seperate legal counsel to conclude the investigation of Dr. Williams based on his own findings. Just like Lou Borgman did not think he could represent the Township (as a whole) based on his friendship with Dr. Williams, he stepped down and let John Bailey take over. Well now John Bailey is stepping down in order to keep his role as the Counsel for Perry Township (again as a whole). This one legal issue regarding Dr. Williams is obviously a lot larger than any one of us knows. If there wasn’t something there, no legal counsel in the world would want to take this case of, what seems like, epic proportions. Attorneys don’t like to lose. That is a fact. And Attorneys also know when they have a case and when they don’t. This wouldn’t have gone on for as long as it has without SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE. That is also a fact.

  3. 3 NOT Impressed Feb 19th, 2007 at 5:01 pm

    Kelly MS,

    I appreciate your effort, but you are naive.

    Borgman was the school board attorney who was relegated to school township attorney due to conflict of interest i.e. a friendly relationship with Williams.

    Bailey, hired by the four, now represents the entire board, as he should. He cannot conduct an investigation because it would be a conflict of interest against the school corporation. It would have been nice if he had figured that one out 3 months ago.

    Lawyers won’t take a case without substantial evidence if they they are paid on contingency basis. Otherwise, they will happily bill until someone gets tired of paying the bill. It doesn’t matter if it’s a no-win situation. Trial lawyers don’t like to lose. Most other lawyers are quite content with spending a lot of billable hours reaching a compromise or simply fact finding and arguing in court.

    I say offer the lawyers the job on a contingency basis and let’s see how many lawyers line up to take a shot at taking Williams down. THAT would be the litmus test as to whether the ‘majority’ board has a leg to stand on.

  4. 4 Kelly Butler Feb 19th, 2007 at 6:47 pm

    If the ‘additional’ attorney is not really ‘additional’, then does that mean it won’t cost us ‘additional’ tax dollars? How many attorneys will “step down in order to continue to represent Perry Township as a whole”? Did you get this information from Jon Bailey? Or did you get this information from a board member? What is the SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE that you refer to, and if it is a FACT, where did you find it??

    You are right in stating that attorneys do not like to lose. Instead of assuming that “this one legal issue regarding Dr. Williams is obviously a lot larger than any one of us knows”, is it not a possibility that Mr. Bailey wants someone else to press this issue because he doesn’t want to be the “loser”?? If Mr. Bailey represents the township as a whole, why doesn’t he attend the board meetings and address the township as a whole?

    Regardless, this is one question that has NEVER been answered….How much does our township owe Mr. Bailey up to this point?? I’d be willing to bet that it’s more than a tenderloin dinner! It is a simple question, but Mrs. Adams simply refuses to answer it. Mr. Maple has repeatedly asked her, but she refuses to answer. Mrs. Houchin asked her at the last board meeting, but she answered her question with a question. Several individuals have asked her during public comments at board meetings. I have emailed her myself, but she does not answer. She has had plenty of time to create a website and put together her “facts”, and she criticizes Dr. Williams for not providing receipts to her in a timely fashion. Why can she not gather this information that WE have requested for weeks?? Simply asking Mr. Bailey how many accumulated hours he has recorded up to now is all that Mrs. Adams would need to do. We can all multiply the number of hours by $250 to get the final answer! $$$$$$$$$$

  5. 5 Teri Margason Feb 19th, 2007 at 7:28 pm

    Kelly M/S: Please share with us the names of Dr. Williams’ relatives and Lee Robbins’ relatives who work for the Southside Times and the Indianapolis Star. And please, share with us the “numerous indescretions” of Dr Williams and members of his administration based upon Indiana Code. As for the attorney situation, you are misinformed. Lou Borgman is still the attorney for the school corporation…he did not agree to step down. Jon Bailey’s capacity has changed as of the last meeting, and he is being kept as the school board’s “special counsel”. He has been authorized by the majority of 4 to hire an additional attorney or team of attorneys to determine if there is cause to proceed with an investigation against Dr. Williams. If that is not hiring “additional” legal counsel (incurring more unnecessary fees coming out of the pockets of Perry taxpayers) I don’t know what you might call it instead. I do agree with you about 2 things ~ Attorneys know when they have a case and when they don’t, and attorneys don’t like to lose. It is my opinion that Jon Bailey is distancing himself from this board because of the lack of anything close to “SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE”. He can see the writing on the wall, and he is pushing back. I’ll be anxious to see your response about the connections to Robbins and Williams at the Southside Times and the Indy Star.

  6. 6 Veritas Gaurdian Feb 19th, 2007 at 8:38 pm

    To Kelly M/S,

    Your statement, “Attorneys don’t like to lose. That is a fact,” is not true. In every case 50% of the attorneys lose. They know this and accept it as a matter of fact. If not losing was a goal in their profession, then 50% of the time they fail. Your statement defies logic.

    The role of the attorney as an agent of the court is to ensure their client’s rights are protected and to ensure that they represent their client to the best of their ability. Other than this, attorneys like to get paid. They do occasional pro bono work, but otherwise they do the job of providing legal advice and get paid to do it.

    This is another example of why the school board majority is losing this battle. They and their supporters convince themselves of something’s truth without consideration of reality. It is very easy to convince yourself that Dr. Williams has done all manner of bad things if you conduct the investigation in a vacuum. I am very thankful to TBPS for ensuring the vacuum is filled with facts and reality.

  7. 7 Kelly M/S Feb 19th, 2007 at 8:48 pm

    Not Impressed why do you feel the need to insult me? I am providing information and websites and you call me naive? I believe it has been stated many times on this website by a lot of different people, pro Williams or anti Williams that calling people names or demeaning them is not to be accepted. Or shouldn’t be accepted rather. I have stopped with insults and I wish the same of you. I am going to hold myself to a higher standard of using what knowledge I have from the information I have obtained to post comments here.

    And trial lawyers do NOT bill until someone gets tired of paying the bill-it is quite unethical and many attorneys have had their licenses taken away for the very practice. A common misconception that people have of lawyers/attorneys. I wish someone would question Lou Borgman and his billing practices.

  8. 8 Kelly M/S Feb 19th, 2007 at 8:54 pm

    Kelly Butler, I totally agree. Let’s see a bill from every attorney from Lou Borgmann to the current attorney and then let’s decide who is billing outrageously. It is possible that John Bailey hasn’t billed the township yet. Some attorneys bill quarterly…then again, that information could also be requested by the Board I am sure. So all in all, I agree with you. If Mr. Maple is requesting those numbers, then he should get them. I wonder if he has tried to call and get them himself? As a member of the Board he is more than entitled and I would encourage him to do so.

    The bylaws of the School Board, State Board of Accounts bylaws, and Indiana Code ALONE is enough to fire Dr. Williams. Like I said earlier, I encourage independent research on this matter. I did it and it was interestingly enough quite easy. And Not Impressed was right in stating “Bailey, hired by the four, now represents the entire board, as he should. He cannot conduct an investigation because it would be a conflict of interest against the school corporation.” and that was all I was trying to say as well. I will commend Not Impressed for wording it better than I.

  9. 9 NOT Impressed Feb 19th, 2007 at 9:00 pm

    Kelly,

    My opinion (from reading years of legalese briefs) is that Mr. Bailey is trying to bow out of an impossible situation. He suggests hiring additional attorneys to do the investigation and has provided a list of attys.

    I don’t know how you get your information. I ask. I don’t know if it’s public knowledge or if it’s supposed to be, so it’s not my job to make it public, or my sources public.

    You didn’t read my reply about Bailey. He is a board atty and deals with board issues. He may be at the next meeting. There has been no invoice submitted to the board, and his rate is $205 per hour. Most attys bill in 10 minute increments.

    You are right about Mrs. Adams. She’s been very vocal about others not being forthcoming in providing her information, but doesn’t feel she needs to be as forthcoming in providing information. What little she does provide is confusing and poorly organized, and not substantiated. Even her resolutions lack focus and clarity.

  10. 10 Admin Feb 19th, 2007 at 9:12 pm

    Kelly M/S, thank you for reminding Not Impressed of the need to be civil. I’m not sure what he was doing was “name calling” but just identifying a trait he believes you to be “naive”. Either way, Not Impressed, please just stick to the facts and refrain from attacking the individuals that comment on this site.

  11. 11 Admin Feb 19th, 2007 at 9:14 pm

    Veritas, although your statement of 50% of all attorney’s lose is technically accurate, it’s misleading. This would only be true if each lawyer took turns losing to each other. There are obviously bad lawyers that lose most of their cases and good lawyers that rarely lose. I would agree that many people don’t like to lose, including lawyers. They just seem to get paid enough to get over it pretty quickly.

  12. 12 Veritas Gaurdian Feb 19th, 2007 at 9:26 pm

    Admin,

    Valid point. Thank you. :)

  13. 13 Teri Margason Feb 19th, 2007 at 10:15 pm

    Kelly M/S….We are still waiting for the names of relatives of Williams and Robbins on staff for the Star and Southside Times. When you make those kinds of allegations, you’d better be ready to back them up with the facts!

  14. 14 Kelly M/S Feb 19th, 2007 at 10:27 pm

    Admin, I appreciate your comments. Thank you for remaining civil towards me as well. We have had our differences in other postings and I feel this is a good opportunity to thank you for even running this site. It is a great forum for all here and thank you for taking the time to run it. I appreciate your efforts whether I agree with you or not. Your basis of providing these sites for informative purposes should be commended.

  15. 15 Kelly Butler Feb 19th, 2007 at 10:49 pm

    I think that some individuals may be thinking that Kelly M/S and I are one in the same. We are not, so I just wanted to clarify that.

    As far as fees for Mr. Borgman….I believe several months ago it was stated at the board meeting that his services are only $75 per hour, which is nearly 1/3 the cost of Mr. Bailey.

    Even if Mr. Bailey chooses to bill quarterly, he has been representing the board since early October. That’s more than ‘a quarter’. Surely Mr. Bailey has shared SOME idea of the number of hours that have accumulated by now. If he has not, then Mrs. Adams needs to be asking!! I have a feeling that if she had an attorney representing her personally and it was her own bill to pay, that she would be asking the approximate amount she owed. It’s just irresponsible not to inquire.

  16. 16 We Support Adams Feb 20th, 2007 at 12:56 pm

    The Southside Times editorial states “The board is accountable to the people. Its responsibilities include over-seeing the spending of revenues, the hiring of key personnel, contract obligations, and setting the policies and practices which direct day-to-day operations.”

    Isn’t that what Adams is doing? Isn’t she overseeing the spending of revenues, the hiring of key personnel, contract obligations and setting the policies and practices to direct day-to-day operations?

    Overseeing of revenue spending: Williams allowed the township to buy $700 worth of tenderloin dinners. Everyone has to admit this was wasteful. She questions travel expenses and Williams refuses to produce receipts.

    Hiring of key personnel: sitting on a committee to oversee hiring, did not Williams strongly oppose this?

    Contract obligations: Adams questions the value of the Edison contract. Is not that the job to question it’s value?

    Setting of policy: Adams ask Williams to stop the negative comments about the board and he refuses (BB & shotgun comments). Was not his day-to-day activity in violation of that policy?

    Since Adams IS doing her job, what is the fuss all about?

  17. 17 Admin Feb 20th, 2007 at 1:40 pm

    I’d say it’s the WAY she’s doing it. If Williams “allowed” the township to buy a $700 dinner, then the board allowed it to happen to, right along with Mr. Nichols and the rest of the food services staff. It was an oversight by all involved, not a blatant disregard for funds. You can’t say the same for the money that’s been spent already and will be spent for the 4 board member’s efforts.

    Regarding hiring key personnel, with the leadership skills and personal ethics of Susan Adams that I’ve personally seen by attending board meetings, I wouldn’t trust her to hire somebody to mow my yard, much less a position in our township.

    It’s absolutely fine for Susan Adams to question the value of the Edison schools and share her opinions of them. The problem is when she doesn’t do the research or ignores the findings and presents incomplete truth to try and validate her opinions.

    If the entire case for getting rid of Dr. Williams is the violation of the stated policies you suggest. Then the entire board should step down as well. Since Dr. Williams works for the board, did they follow procedure for verbal and written warnings with agreed and stated expectations and timeline for fulfilling the requirements? No? They just put him on paid administrative leave. Seems a little like overkill.

  18. 18 NOT Impressed Feb 20th, 2007 at 3:04 pm

    Ok, I apologize for saying Kelly M/S is naive.

    The comments suggest a lack of real-world experience.

    Kelly M/S,

    The State Board of Accounts has an obligation in their findings to look at ‘intent’. Sloppy bookkeeping is one thing and is not something you necessarily fire someone for - particularly if they weren’t directly responsible for the bookkeeping. Fraud and misuse is another thing. The State Board of Accounts leaned on the side of sloppiness in their findings. If you audit any larger corporation’s books you will find things that look irregular - it’s just the nature of the beast.

    Why do you find a need to interpret these findings as an intent to misuse? Would you not want someone to look at your intent?

  19. 19 Kelly M/S Feb 20th, 2007 at 4:02 pm

    To Not Impressed

    I am 24 years old, a paralegal and currently a law student. That is where I base my knowledge and fact. Maybe I don’t have 40 yrs of “real-world” experience in your opinion, but I am going to use what knowledge and fact finding investigative resources that I do have at my fingertips to find the truth in any capacity that I can.

  20. 20 Kelly M/S Feb 20th, 2007 at 4:09 pm

    Teri M.

    I could be wrong, but based on the information I have in front of me, you should already know the answer to the question you have asked of me. Although again, as I have stated before, I found this out on my own. It’s very easy to research these simple questions; especially when you know what you are looking for.

  21. 21 Admin Feb 20th, 2007 at 4:12 pm

    Kelly M/S, if you’ve got the information in front of you, why don’t you just share it? What is it with people having information and not sharing it? The future of our township and our children’s education shouldn’t be left up to some data scavenger hunt. If you’ve got the info in front of you, start typing or provide a link to where you got it.

  22. 22 Kelly M/S Feb 20th, 2007 at 4:17 pm

    Maybe someone could answer this heresay/gossip that I have heard…what about the whole, Dr. Williams doesn’t support No Child Left Behind. Is that true? Does anyone know for a fact whether he does or doesn’t support it? I am just curious that is all. I think this is an EXCELLENT government program. There are many children in the township (based only on what my sister and brother tell me!) that are not what you would say “up to par” where they should be. I don’t remember this kind of environment in any of my school years in Perry. Is this unsubstantiated gossip?

  23. 23 ken Feb 20th, 2007 at 4:53 pm

    I agree with Admin. If people claim to have information and fail to share that information, they must understand how others interpret that type of claim. Claiming you have certain information but failing to share said information gives the appearance to many as if they are just throwing out accusations.

    Kelly M/S, as a paralegal and law student, you are and will be held to a higher standard in everything you do…..especially when it comes to disclosing easy to find “known” information. The nature of your profession dictates that level of professional standard.
    I am not saying I agree with it, but as the spouse of an attorney I am very aware of that standard.

  24. 24 Admin Feb 20th, 2007 at 6:36 pm

    From what I understand Dr. Williams and numerous other teachers that I am friends with support the spirit of the NCLB program, but state that the real-world application of the requirements is where the problems lie with the program.

    What I’m about to say probably won’t be very popular, but it’s the way I feel. Although I don’t understand all of the details of NCLB, I believe the desire to not have any of our children be ill equipped for the real world should be pursued. Therefore we should strive to provide as good an opportunity for them to learn as possible.

    My problem is that if teachers have to consistently slow down or degrade the efforts of their task to educate the majority of children that are succeeding at the given pace, it’s only further dumbing down the entire community.

  25. 25 NCLB Feb 20th, 2007 at 9:26 pm

    From the minutes of the 8/11/03 meeting:

    Mr. Robbins said Dr. Williams articulated at the Opening Day meeting
    how difficult education has become with the No Child Left Behind (NCLB) standards that are in place. He believes that having two elementary schools published in the newspaper as deficient schools must be
    demoralizing and hurtful not only to those in the schools, but to the entire educational community. Mr. Robbins said Dr. Williams explained at the Opening Day meeting that NCLB standards aren’t working as they should and the tests don’t measure the success of the teachers. The standards don’t reward teachers for their efforts, but actually punish them for their work. Mr. Robbins believes that Dr. Williams’ comments at the meeting would soften the effects of NCLB and motivate all teachers. He said Dr. Williams’ comments needed to be made and he appreciates the fact that he was willing to speak about it.

    From the minutes of 11/10/03

    Mr. Maple said the more he reads national coverage the more obvious it becomes that educators throughout the country are frustrated with the No Child Left Behind (NCLB) legislation. He noted that the emphasis is on criticizing public schools and making it virtually impossible for them to succeed. Mr. Maple believes this school corporation needs to continue to emphasize serious reservations about the statute and that we won’t be complacent about the federal government destroying public schools. He noted that there was an article in the New York Times about the Houston school corporation underreporting their crimes and that the current Secretary of Education was selected from the Houston school system.

    From the minutes of 09/12/05

    Dr. Williams noted that our schools would be conducting ISTEP testing next week. He informed the Board that he will continue to keep them informed on our progress and how it relates to the current No Child Left Behind Act.

  26. 26 Perry teacher on NCLB Feb 20th, 2007 at 10:10 pm

    I am a teacher in Perry and let me give you some of my thoughts on NCLB. The idea behind the law is worthwhile. We should hold teachers, principals, Twp. administrators, parents, and children accountable for their educational progress. There are huge problems with the president’s law, however. First off, Kelly M/S, it is not a government program. Nor is it excellent. It is an unfunded mandate that puts teachers in a horrible position. There is way too much emphasis on standardized tests such as ISTEP. What we need are individualized benchmarks that give a much more clear picture of student growth. The way the law is being enforced in Indiana (PL 221), a student with a learning disability, a student with a low IQ, a student who barely speaks English all have to measure up the same as students who do not have such obstacles. Then you take into account the children from unstable homes who get little or no parental support. Many are being neglected or abused and they are expected to hit the same target score on a test as a student from a much more structured household with loving parents who prioritize books, learning, and school. Dr. Williams realizes the flaw of this type of reasoning. Williams often has said the law just is simply unfair to the schools and teachers that service a high percentage of poor students, students from foreign language speaking households, and students who are receiving special education. I have been so proud of Dr. Williams for speaking out against this horrible law and sticking up for great schools here in Perry like Winchester Village, Abraham Lincoln, and Clinton Young. He realizes that the teachers in these schools often have to work twice as hard as the schools that service a higher percentage of more structured, middle class families. Don’t get me wrong, I personally think that the teachers at Douglas MacArthur and Glenns Valley etc. are excellent and do a wonderful job. I am just so proud to have a superintendent like Williams who does not throw the principals and teachers under the bus just because they choose to work in schools with a more challenging teaching environment. And I feel compelled to tell Mrs. Adams that these principals and teachers try many innovative strategies to reach their students. They are anything but mediocre. Williams has given the good folks at these schools a pat on the back and an encouraging word even when they might not have reached AYP (NCLB’s definition of adequate yearly progress). All Perry teachers know that Dr. Williams has high expectations of us, but we also know that he supports us and tries to educate the public of the snares of NCLB. As I said earlier, what we really need to be fair to everyone involved in a child’s educational progress is individualized assessment. If Student A comes into my class and scores a 450 on a Laguauge Arts assessment at the beginning of the year, I would expect this student to score much higher on a similar Language Arts test at the end of our time together. Student A cannot be compared to Student B for reasons I have already stated but both Student A and Student B should be showing strong progress in all curriculum areas. The good news is that I am confident that is exactly what is happening in my classroom with my students. The bad news is that thanks to NCLB, some of my students, some of our teachers, and some of our principals and administrators will be labeled as “failing” just because we choose to educate the students that need us the most. I apologize that this ended up being such a long post, but as you can see - NCLB is a “hot button” issue with me.

  27. 27 Admin Feb 20th, 2007 at 10:29 pm

    Thank you for that explanation. It highlights perfectly the same sentiments I’ve heard from other teachers that are friends of mine in Perry Township and other states.

  28. 28 Interested observer Feb 20th, 2007 at 10:40 pm

    I’m a veteran teacher, not in PT, and Perry Teacher’s assessment of NCLB is spot on. What Dr. Williams has said is what’s on the mind of virtually every teacher and administrator in the country. The difference is that he had the guts to vocalize his thoughts.

  29. 29 Teri Margason Feb 21st, 2007 at 12:03 am

    Kelly M/S - I do not know the answer to the question or I would not have asked. Please name the people you know are related to Robbins and Williams that are on the staff of the publications you listed. You state you have verified this information on your own, and I am waiting to hear your answer. Publish the names here if you are so sure. If you are not so sure, please print a retraction. Many accusations are being made, by you and others, that cannot be substantiated. Your allegation is one of those unsubstantiated claims. Please step forward and be accountable or admit your mistake. We are waiting.

  30. 30 Who is this guy? Feb 21st, 2007 at 7:48 am

    On occasion I see vitriolic letters to the editor from a guy named Norman Clampitt. Who is this person and what’s his story?

  31. 31 Nancy Douglass Feb 21st, 2007 at 10:37 am

    First of all, the explanation of NCLB by Perry Teacher is fabulous. Students should not be compared to each other, it’s their individual growth and progress, or lack thereof, that should be measured and compared to, again, their own prior benchmarks. And of course, if a student is not making progress, and he/she is found capable, there should be accountability. Perry Teacher on NCLB’s explanation and opinion may be one of the best posts yet. Thank you for the time it took to write it.

    On Norman Clampitt, I believe he has run for a Perry board position several times and has never had enough support to win. If memory serves me correctly, he’s been a pretty outspoken opponent of the majority of past and present board members and administrators.

  32. 32 PerryTeacher Feb 25th, 2007 at 5:07 pm

    Norm Clampitt is a retired teacher who worked at schools in Perry Township many years ago.

    What I have heard from those who knew him is that he has an axe to grind with not being supported by adminstration while he was a teacher. He has been retired for quite some time.

    I think he feels he wasn’t treated well by Williams during Norm’s time as a teacher, hence the grudge.

    Notice that many of the people leading the “Ditch Doug” movement all have grudges?

  33. 33 Kelly M/S Feb 26th, 2007 at 12:06 pm

    I don’t have a grudge against him at all. Although he has made inappropriate comments and been a self proclaimed “smart-a**”-(his own words) I find that he has broken Indiana Code and the Board bylaws and therefore, should be fired. That’s the bottom line. Maybe the investigation into his behavior and actions started from grudges, but to have actually found IC that he has violated is a pretty big deal in my book. I wonder if the Board has brought the broken IC to Sue Ellen Reed’s attention? I’m sure she would be interested to know.

  34. 34 DMM Feb 26th, 2007 at 6:10 pm

    No, Kelly M/S, if you look at my letter from Sue Ellen Reed under the topic Personal Thank You and Community Challenge, you’ll see that she says she doesn’t have any authority in this matter.

  35. 35 Kelly M/S Feb 26th, 2007 at 10:03 pm

    Okay-I am sorry I had not had the opportunity to read that yet. Thank you DMM for pointing it out to me.

  36. 36 To Kelly M/S Feb 27th, 2007 at 12:50 pm

    I would think that since you are a law student, you would stop asking questions with “this may be gossip or hearsay”! Don’t come to us asking those types of questions. Several times now Teri Margason has asked you to provide your information/accusation about Lee Robbins having relatives working for the papers. PROVIDE the FACTS Kelly! Believe me, we’ve all been communicating with the Department of Education, and many other avenues to see about getting these four women off of our board. It is very disapointing to know they have no one to answer to except their constituents and you see how that is working.

    Kelly, be careful. You are receiving your information from dangerous people. They have turned on many people and won’t blink an eye before turning on you. I hope in your research you find what we have. Nothing! The only thing they really have is that they don’t like Dr. Williams’ personality–I wonder if a personality conflict is really worth the thousands of dollars they are willing to waste!

  37. 37 Kelly M/S Feb 27th, 2007 at 2:43 pm

    I know for a fact Teri Margeson knows the people I have found on the Southside Times and Indystar to be affiliated with Dr. Williams/Lee Robbins. I shouldn’t have to provide information to someone who is willing to hide among you as a sheep among the wolves. There is plenty of information that Teri has. I do not have any respect for Teri and I will not speak to Teri further on the matter. Now if Mr. Bean directly contacted me wanting that information, that’s a different story and I would be more than willing to provide that information to him directly.

    In saying it was gossip, I was stating that I had specifically heard gossip and wanted fact to back it up. I didn’t want anyone thinking I was putting out false information about Dr. Williams. It was gossip but if it is found to be true then how much longer would he have stayed in Perry anyway? That’s my main point to that question and if it is gossip then I will apologize as again, I do not want to relay false information about him when there is already plenty of that to go around.

  38. 38 ken Feb 27th, 2007 at 2:44 pm

    From what I have read over the past month, it appears that Kelly M/S from the WSW site is the same person as Karen M/S on the TBPS site.

  39. 39 Admin Feb 27th, 2007 at 3:08 pm

    Kelly, consider yourself contacted by me. Please send the information to info@wesupportwilliams.com

    Regardless of my opinions of anyone in opposition to my views, if they requested information from me that I had in my posession and the authority to provide to them, I’d do without question. I’m not sure why you couldn’t provide the same consideration. If we’re truly all in this together and trying to move forward in all of this mess, I don’t see how withholding information that you state is publicly available is helping the situation at all.

    If you’d like me to personally give you a call to request the information, just let me know.

  40. 40 Kelly Butler Feb 27th, 2007 at 3:33 pm

    Interesting observation, Ken, because I had thought the same thing.

    I find it interesting when certain individuals want to claim that they know something for a fact, yet they refuse to back it up. It seems rather childish to make a claim, then to say that if others want to know it, they’ll have to figure it out for themselves. It’s like saying, “I’ve got a new toy, and I’m not going to share it! If you want one…….you’ll have to get your own!”

    I feel that this website is designed to SHARE information with others……as well as the source of said information. If Lee Robbins and Dr. Williams are truly “related” to the editors of the newspapers, then anyone with proof of that knowledge should gladly share it. Otherwise, it is nothing more than gossip.

    As far as Teri Margason goes…….I’m proud of her for speaking up and standing up for what she believes in. She did an awesome job speaking last evening. She is a lovely person with a lovely family. Our daughters danced together as young girls, and I have had great respect for her as a parent, as well. Teri…….please don’t let the ugly words of individuals tear you down.

    ALL of the individuals who spoke last evening did a terrific job, and I thank you for being the “voice” for many. I particularly enjoyed Barbara Need adding a touch of humor to this very heart-wrenching situation!! The board majority certainly have given women a bad name!

  41. 41 NOT Impressed Feb 27th, 2007 at 5:09 pm

    Kelly M/S

    No one likes to be attacked or insulted (as it has been pointed out to me). Please leave Teri M out of this discussion as she didn’t bring it up, you did. You said you have this proof. All anyone has asked is for you to provide the proof. Please do not deflect; just back up your statements with facts.

  42. 42 Teri Margason Feb 27th, 2007 at 7:54 pm

    Kelly M/S ~ Do you have some anger management issues? You kind of went off on me for no reason! First of all, if you know so much about me, I would think I might have a clue about who you are, but alas, you refuse to publish your name. That is OK, though … I’m sure you have your reasons. When you float “gossip” out there looking for facts, we all know what you are doing and why. You are just trying to spread more rumors. Let me give you a hint about the connections between Robbins, Williams and the various newspapers….there aren’t any. Period. That is why I was pressing you for an answer. I knew you wouldn’t have one. Kelly Butler, thank you for your nice comments, and believe me, the hateful words of this person do nothing to tear me down. I believe in what I am doing 100%, because my actions are based on pure facts and supported by a huge majority of this township. Kelly M/S, I’d suggest you devote more time to your legal studies and less to the witch hunt of the gang of 4. In order to be a good attorney, one thing you have to be able to do is separate fact from fiction, and in that area, you have a lot to learn. As for the comment about me being a “sheep among the wolves”, I’d try and address that, but I have no idea what you are talking about. I did get a laugh out of it, however. Since you promised Jason informaton, I’ll be anxious to hear what you think you know!

  43. 43 So Tired of This! Feb 28th, 2007 at 12:32 am

    To Kelly M/S post of 2/19

    My goodness! I checked all of those websites and find only general info about the govt. agency or assn. Any conclusions about Dr. Williams’ behavior is totally your interpretation of codes, laws, policies, etc. What you say is just more unfounded, unsustantiated gibberish. Let’s hear specifics with evidence!

    Also, whether one attorney steps down or not, he is still an additional attorney on the payroll. We now have 4 attorneys -Mr. Borgman, John Bailey, the new gun from Lafayette, and his asst. That makes 4 attorneys we are paying. No matter how you count them, there are 4!

    They are not CONCLUDING any investigation; they are
    BEGINNING it. Your gang of 4 have already admitted that.

    Attorneys don’t want to lose UNLESS they they see a goldmine being given to them by “easily-had,” incompetent women. Don’t be so naive, Kelly M/S.

  44. 44 Georgia Stumpf Feb 28th, 2007 at 1:03 am

    You all know what? I think Kelly M/S and others who are totally illogical are just “pulling our chains” and laughing like heck at us! I don’t think Kelly M/S is a law student at all. A person has to know how to tell fact from fiction to get into law school, and Kelly M/S doesn’t differentiate. Kelly M/S has nothing on Doug Williams or any other administrator either.

    Kelly M/S is just having some sort of sick fun with us who are so tied up in this township morass. Kelly M/S seems to enjoy being irrational because he/she knows it bothers many of us who take this situation so seriously.

    I say let’s ignore Kelly M/S and turn our discussion to folks who really do not understand or agree with anti-board folks for legitimate, substantiated reasons. I love open discussion, and I encourage it. I wish there were more of it - esp. at school board meetings.

  45. 45 Amy Stinson Feb 28th, 2007 at 2:01 pm

    Hey People,

    When someone comes up with a specific ‘wrongdoing’ and ties it with a specific code, I will listen,and then go look for myself. But whenever someone comes up and says they’ve read this and that and it proves that someone has done wrong without stating which specific code matched what specific wrong, I just ignore them. They’re nothing more than pot stirrers.

    The truth is that nearly weekly it can be said that these women are guilty of the same abuses that they found themselves unable to tolerate out of others.

    I have a call in to the administrative office right now asking why the funds set aside for 2 members of the board to attend the NASB conference in April are $400 more EACH than the other 2. I want to know why they couldn’t have made arrangements back when it was $160 less per person to attend.

    It just appalls me when someone is griping about a $5 coke and a $700 meal (that THEY asked for) and then turn around and think nothing of pi$$ing away $1440 on a weekend in San Francisco, $8500 on a lawyer, and even the snacks they insist upon having served to them during board meetings.

    They need to get a clue that this works both ways.

  46. 46 Very Interested Observer [outside MSDPT] Mar 16th, 2007 at 1:38 pm

    …I am sorry you are all going through this - and I am not suggesting that you quiet your calls for accountability and information - but I am concerned that you are fighting a battle that may not be won (or MAY be won only by destroying the things you think you are fighting over).

    IF no answers to any of your questions are forthcoming…

    IF it boils down to personal opinion and past “grudges”…

    IF none of the boardmembers will leave before their terms expire…

    …WHAT do you (TBPS) want to accomplish?

    - What is YOUR vision for Perry Township schools?

    - What is YOUR willingness to participate “in the meantime” with MSDPT AS IT STANDS today? (Note: ‘celebrating’ and amplifying the effect this board’s actions has and will have on the district may make it harder to get back to the business of making the district a great place for your kids).

  47. 47 Amy Stinson Mar 19th, 2007 at 10:15 am

    I agree that ‘winning’ this battle may destroy what we are trying to preserve and improve and ultimately this will hurt the children. If ISTEP scores were to improve through all this and graduation rates increase, then these board members will not hesitate to take the credit. If ISTEP scores do not improve and graduation rates fall, they will not hesitate to blame this group. Either way, this group can’t win.

    So far, it appears that the majority board’s ‘vision’ consists of dismantling the current system from the top down. What they haven’t provided is a vision for what they plan to put in its place other than better test scores and higher graduation rates. There has not been much said about how they will go about doing this. Based upon what they have done so far and how they have gone about it, there is little confidence in the outcome, at least on my part.

    There is a little more than a year left before the primary elections which could theoretically replace 2 of the rogue board members. Four of the seats are up for election in 2008. I personally think that is where the group should focus its energy and start raising up candidates. I think we also need to find a suitable candidate in the Northern Community as I don’t feel whining about lost opportunities and preaching about everyone else’s perceived attitudes is representing the Northern Community’s best interests.

    Now that the community is paying some high-priced lawyers, the process could slow in order for some lawyers to make some money. While I’m not necessarily advocating high lawyer bills, the time spent ‘investigating’ Williams could be favorable to the TBPS cause. The longer an investigation takes, the less likely anything is there to indicate cause - other than the board’s neglect of due diligence and oversight (which I doubt they even thought of in their quest to oust Williams) and the closer to May 2008 and presumably the beginning of the end of this era.

  48. 48 Nance Mar 19th, 2007 at 8:32 pm

    If you have not seen the results of the Perry teacher vote regarding teacher viewpoint of the current Perry school board, check out this link: http://takebackperryschools.com/news/

    Highlights (or lowlights depending on how you look at things):

    - 97% of teachers who voted want Dr. Williams reinstated

    - less than 1% of Perry teachers have confidence in the decisions being made by four members of our current school board

    Being one of the teachers who participated in this vote, I can share a couple of interesting observations.

    1. This vote was done secret ballot and no one was required to vote.

    2. Roughly 85% of Perry classroom teachers stayed after school on a
    Friday to vote.

  49. 49 Mrs. Butler Mar 20th, 2007 at 8:56 am

    Tim Nance…I’m astounded every time I read the statistics from the teacher’s vote of confidence. I’m amazed that such a large number of teachers participated on a Friday afternoon!!

    I recognize at every school board meeting that there are many, many teachers in attendance…wearing orange! I think back to the many, many meetings that the board majority tried to convince us that the teachers of MSDPT felt intimidated by Dr. Williams. They told us that the teachers were afraid of him. All of this simply confirms the fact that the board majority declare FALSE information again and again. They try to convince the public that they have good and pure intentions, and that they are simply trying to clean up the “mess” that existed in this township…that they are just trying to “help”.

    I’ve read some posts that a couple of individuals think that TBPS efforts may be more harmful than helpful to this community. I disagree. TBPS has been able to make the public aware of the truth about what the teachers think/feel regarding this situation. TBPS has made an unsuspecting, unknowing public aware of what the board has been up to. TBPS has raised the public’s interest in local politics, and most certainly, there will be a significant increase in individuals who show up to vote for school board in 2008!!! TBPS has helped to ensure that there is no way that Adams, Alexander, Walsh, or Thompson will EVER EVER be re-elected! Look what the school board has done since last fall. What would they attempt to do if they thought no one was watching???? What would they do if they thought they could push something through without having it plastered in the newspapers??

    On a very positive note, I will add that I have met many, many wonderful individuals from this community throughout this process. Not only do I share smiles and conversations at school board meetings with individuals I may have never met otherwise, I see my new friends at restaurants, the post office, school, church, and local businesses. This travesty has helped draw the MSDPT neighbors closer. While a couple of individuals have tried to claim that TBPS is a divisive organization, it is quite the opposite! TBPS is an organization that has created a great deal of unity in MSDPT.

  50. 50 Owen Mar 20th, 2007 at 9:35 am

    As a parent, voter and taxpayer in Perry Township I am concerned about what these elected officials are doing to our schools, taxes, property values, etc. I may not be able to replace them till the next election, but I did not elect them to carry out personal vendettas that don’t benefit MSDPT, and I will not step aside to let them do whatever they want. Our elected officials need to be accountable to their public. This may have a negative effect by amplifying the Boards actions and I regret that. But, I believe to keep quiet while these Board members destroy our schools would be a greater travesty. In addition to walking out of Board meetings, the 4 members have been rude, insulting, name calling, and condescending to the public, teachers and administrators. Below is a condensed chronology of events .

    * 4 members conspired and gained control of School Board Officer Positions.
    * Adams modifies and misrepresents Atty. Borgmanns renewal contract .
    * Adams & Walsh begin micromanaging.
    * Williams reprimands Walsh for overstepping her job description
    * Thompson files false police report against Williams
    * 4 members hire Atty. Bailey to Investigate Williams
    * Adams lies to other board members and public at board meeting.
    * 4 members place Williams on administrative leave.
    * 4 members vote against mediation with Dr. Williams.
    * New Tech HS Delayed till 2008.
    * NESSI Grant lost for 2007.
    * Thompson calls for independent audit (potential cost $100,000).
    * 4 members vote against mediation with Dr. Williams.
    * Open Public Forum approved.
    * Bailey attends Finance meeting - no major violations of law.
    * 4 members hire board facilitator - reject free facilitator.
    * Delayed Open Public Forum.
    * Adams reads Timeline.
    * Adams reads Finance Meeting Report - makes unsupported accusations.
    * Adams claims Williams termination to only cost $36,000. (Actual costs over $500,000)
    * Indianapolis Star - No evidence to justify Williams suspension.
    * 4 members hire Lafayette Atty. & assistant to investigate Williams.
    * Adams & Thompson want to rehash approved Edison contract.
    * 4 members vote against mediation with Dr. Williams.
    * 4 members ignore request to schedule Open Pubic Forum.
    * 4 members want to reopen approved construction bids.
    * Teacher survey - 97% have no confidence in this board.

    Note: Contrary to what some may want you to believe, Dr. Williams is NOT terminated…he is on administrative leave! He can be reinstated! However, the real issue here is not Dr. Williams. The real issue is the unethical behavior of 4 members of this board!

  1. 1 Board Meeting Reminder for this Monday at Citizens in Support of Dr. Williams Pingback on Feb 25th, 2007 at 12:15 am
  2. 2 Take Back Perry Schools » Board Meeting Reminder for this Monday Pingback on Feb 25th, 2007 at 12:17 am
  3. 3 Things I’m Still Waiting On at Citizens in Support of Dr. Williams Pingback on Mar 8th, 2007 at 12:04 pm

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